Fremantle Space

A Head of the Curve

Helping a billion people is an ambitious goal. Meet the man who plans to achieve it.

Words: Jason Normandale, Photography: Sabine Albers

fSpace: There are so many interesting things about your company Curve, from designing technology that improves healthcare; to working directly with leading health professionals, researchers and patients; to having offices on four continents. And then there’s that goal: “to improve a billion lives around the world”. 

But before we get into all that, let’s talk about you. How would you introduce yourself?

Mo Jaimangal: That’s a good question. From a business standpoint?

No, just generally …  

Hmmmm, well … I’ve never actually thought of that. You’ve stumped me on the first question! (laughs)

(laughs) Fantastic! And the questions get harder!

I’d say I’m Mo, and I’m a big believer in trying to make the world a better place, trying to help those who are in need. I started this company because I wanted to help people who don’t have access to healthcare or the ability to improve their lives, to release some of the pain they’re in. I wanted to see if I could use the things that I’ve learned from school and industry, and apply them directly to help people in tough situations.

I’m a pretty competitive person, I love sports. That goal of a billion lives will drive me to spend my life trying to achieve it. If I get to it sooner, great, but then I’ll probably go for two billion. And given technology, its impact, and how quickly it can get to people, maybe a billion isn’t such a crazy target.

You have quite the education mix with Mechanical Engineering, Computer Science and Mechatronics. Take me back to your decision to study those degrees – was it a master plan back then, an extension of childhood interests, or some kind of torture from your parents?

I’ve always been a tinkerer. I was always playing with computers, taking bikes and equipment apart and putting them back together. I was always curious how things were built.

It’s probably an immigrant family thing but my parents wanted me to be a doctor, they really pushed me to be a surgeon or a doctor in healthcare. They bought me doctor books and games, where I’d have to operate on something, so that kind of medical bend grew early. Though when I got to high school, I just thought I’d be playing basketball –

Right, in the NBA with Lebron …

(Laughs) No – the NBL. I wasn’t good enough for the NBA, but the NBL … maybe. But when I started getting serious about what I was going to do in university, I put medicine down as my first choice, but secretly wanted to study engineering. And mechatronics just sounded cool.

While you were studying, you were also starting some small businesses. One in particular had strong social components such as breaking barriers, employing disadvantaged people and having a strong social reinvestment. Where did this interest come from? Why is it important to you? 

I guess coming from a third world country, a pretty dangerous country –

Which country is this? 

British Guiana in South America. It’s part of the Caribbean mainland south America. Lots of violence, really poor, a situation you want to escape if you can. My parents left with pretty much nothing and came to Australia when my brother and I were little boys.

There weren’t many other immigrants during the early 80’s where we lived and as a result, we experienced a lot of racism and felt alienated or substandard to everyone else. I think that feeling stuck with me for a long time, a feeling of trying to get to equality.

I have this thing about trying to make the world equitable. I think that by helping create access to things that everyone else has access to, opportunities will grow from there. That’s part of my upbringing and my experience coming here as a little boy. The experience of being different really shapes you, makes you tough. It makes you a fighter – a fighter for a cause I felt I had to overcome.

Shortly after graduating, you found yourself in Detroit as part of a leadership team for innovation and development for General Motors. Developing future technology for one of the largest automotive companies in the world sounds like a pretty sweet job with a lot of potential, but you left to start Curve. A lot of people would feel reluctant to leave the stability and security of a high profile job in an established company. What motivated you to make that decision?

Yeah, it was kind of a dream engineering job – unlimited budgets, traveling the world, cool tech, cars 10 years out. I mean you dream about that stuff as an engineering student, and I love cars so it was right up my alley.

But a problem with working on innovation in big corporations is that it’s really hard to get something that helps people or the planet into production. Those production lines are driven by business, by making as much money as you can out of each car. That’s just how most corporations are set up, to make as much money as possible for the shareholders.

It’s really disappointing when you work on stuff that would make a positive impact on the customers, like improving their driving experience or safety, but then those things don’t make it into a car. So I was never able to close the loop of building something and see it impact people. That’s why I wanted to leave and do something where I knew I’d be in control, even if it would be on a smaller scale.

You’ve told me that building companies also helped you appreciate the value of working with friends. Even now, several of your friends are directors in Curve. Talk about this value of working with friends – what is it and why is it important to you?

Friendship is bigger than running a company, and as long as you have similar goals, working style and ethics, then it’s easy. If your goals are about making money, then it’s harder. But if your goals are about improving the world, and you make money as a consequence of that, then it’s easier to work and make decisions, because everyone is passionate about making a positive change.

We just share a vision of what we’re here for. We’re not trying to dominate the world. Our vision is about those one billion lives. We can argue and have disagreements on how to get there, but as long as we keep it to a level that isn’t personal, our friendships remain intact.

We check our egos and make sure that no one is above anyone else. We’re in this together and we try to succeed as much as we can, rather than ‘I want to be bigger or better than you’. I have a lot of admiration around their morals and how they go about work.

That ego checking is backed by the team page on your website – it only shows faces and names. Why are job titles avoided in your company?

I think titles can box people in a bit and create barriers where there don’t need to be any. Particularly if you take an executive role where, if I’m CEO or CTO and you’re a developer or engineer, it automatically creates this barrier that I’m more experienced or better than you, that ‘I run the company, so don’t waste my time’.

I’ve worked in organisations like that, where people are afraid to go two levels up. For us, we want a graduate or a student to come up to us and say ‘hey, I think you guys are running your company like shit’ and I would sit down with them and say ‘tell me about that’. I want to hear what they see that we don’t. We really want to foster that openness where at anytime, anyone can call us out on anything.

That is very rare.

Yeah, it creates a shared responsibility model. Even though a handful of us run the company, as directors we want to share what we’re doing and why.

We set goals as a team – like x revenue or y profit – and we don’t hide that stuff. We want to be as open as we can. We want everyone in the company to feel comfortable sharing what they think we’re doing right or wrong.

There are a lot of products showcased on Curve’s website. One of these products is a free app, Headcheck, that helps parents and coaches identify concussion symptoms in children. There’s another that’s for health professionals to quickly and accurately diagnose behavioural conditions.

How do you decide which projects to work on? Do you strive for a balance of big long-term projects with some that are more low-hanging fruit? There must be some that are tempting because they might develop relationships or increase awareness.

Yeah, it’s a combination. There are some low-hanging apps that we get out, then there are some products we build that show what we can do, to help open doors. But because we’ve been around a while now, we’re moving into a place where we can ask questions like ‘how serious are you to getting this out to people?’ and ‘how many people will you impact?’ Our big driver is that metric, and if we’re true to that, we have to look at all our contracts through that lens.

For instance, if a project is a million dollars but it isn’t really going to get out and help anyone, whereas another project is a hundred thousand dollars but is going to impact 5,000 people, we seriously have to look at that. The million-dollar project, while it would give us great revenue, we’re probably not going to take it because it’s not going to help anyone.

When you have these large visions and goals, it’s the projects you say to no to that you prove how real you are.

Curve partners with leading hospitals in Australia and you’ve had interesting opportunities, such as observing surgery as part of your research. How did that come about and what it was like?

You can really live in a bubble where you don’t know all the things that are going on. Actually having an office inside a hospital is amazing because you’re confronted with what’s happening every day. Seeing kids who have cerebral palsy or are suffering through cancer treatment, that really motivates you to do something to help them go through their journey and have a better life.

I’ve been lucky enough to follow the head of surgery for The Royal Children’s Hospital in Melbourne into his theatre. And it wasn’t just watching the operation – it was meeting the parents and the child beforehand, talking with them and understanding what they’re going through, their emotions. I got to experience that whole journey from all points of view – the doctor, his team, the parents and the child. It really opens your eyes to the health system, where it’s great, where’s bad, where it can be improved.

It also gives you motivation from an innovative, engineering perspective: how can we take our system in Australia – one that has some of the best medical minds in the world – how can we make it better? How can we make it available to those who don’t have it?

We think about all these things, but also about really understanding the emotions people go through. When we build products, it’s not just to solve a technical problem. It’s about how do we make this person feel better about their life.

Within Fremantle, there are a lot of inspiring people helping others or promoting healthy changes. But moving the public consciousness, whether it’s for health, education or the environment is always challenging. Dealing with various levels of government as well as public entities like hospitals and universities must present some additional bureaucratic and political challenges.

Yeah, it’s hard, especially working with government or big not-for-profit organizations – they’re all very strict on how they do things. We know things can be slow and take time of slowly moving the needle and building trust. Once you’ve started to deliver and show that you’re true to your word, the doors open more easily, and people begin to trust. But that takes time and we haven’t found a way to shortcut that process.

What’s next for Curve? What are you most excited about?

We’re starting to get more visibility with government and some of our projects are getting out there and getting a lot more use. Impact is one of the key things we measure and we’re starting to see our impact numbers grow.

We’re always looking how we can accelerate the growth of our impact to people. Whether it’s through different marketing channels or continuing to focus on projects we know are going to make a bigger difference.

We’ve also started to develop our own projects, ones that don’t have a specific partner or collaborator. We’ve seen so much from the different parts of healthcare that we’ve been asking ourselves: what are we seeing that no one else is seeing? What can we look at and try to put out there? It’s exciting.

This interview is from FREMANTLE Space, a magazine that explores work, life and community in Fremantle.

The following is from FREMANTLE Space, the fSpace magazine which celebrates the people who have embraced the ethos of small coworking space in the heart of Fremantle.

By Alexei Tsallis

It’s 9:05 am. You’ve just spent an hour in bumper-to-bumper traffic on your way to work in the CBD. You’re late for a meeting. You speed walk through the foyer past strangers who don’t make eye contact. You scan emails on your phone as you wait for an elevator. You push forward into an empty carriage before the ding announcing its arrival fades. You stare ahead, your thoughts alternating between your meeting and why the damn lift won’t go faster. Finally, the doors open to your floor, but your freedom from containment is short-lived as you sit in your small office. Rapidly pulling some papers together, you glance at a quote you printed on your first day: “You have to be the change you want to see in the world.” You cringe, knowing that yesterday was the same, and that tomorrow will be no different.

THAT is the type of workspace that the coolest company you’ve likely never heard of wanted to avoid. Fremantle-based Ausvet, a team of consultant epidemiologists, is the company which get calls from governments all over the world to explain the science of diseases and to discover solutions. I sat down with founder Dr Ben Madin to find out what Ausvet has been up to since they left fSpace, and also what they actually do.

“Global health is not about separate beings. It is the interrelation of all animals, humans, fish and plants. When one fails, so do the others.”

(Ausvet Team)

Many things can cause a disease: bacteria, a virus, a toxin and a nutritional deficit are just some examples. When Ausvet is called on to consult on a situation, the company takes everything into account. Says Ben, “Epidemiology strictly means the study of disease across (epi) people (demos), but in our world it really means the relationship between the affected person, animal or plant, the environment they are in and the agent that is causing the disease.” There is often a crossover as agriculture problems affect humans, which is why Ausvet is increasingly doing more plant work. “Most diseases in the world affect more than just one species.” Ben begins to laugh while adding, “And humans, whether we like to believe it or not, are just one of those species.”

When an industry has a problem or a disease within their production, Ben and his team look at all the potential factors. “Other than doing laboratory work or pathology work, we are asked to come out and look at the bigger picture.” A lot of the work he does involves comparing and contrasting healthy properties with unhealthy ones. “Sometimes it’s a difference within a person or animal and sometimes it’s a difference within the environment in which they live.”

Ausvet also deals with human diseases. One such example is Goitre, a thyroid disease that is mainly caused by an iodine deficiency. The disease had not been an issue in Australia since salt was iodised, but Ausvet was brought in to investigate a resurgence. They discovered several reasons for its return, including the fact that much of the iodised salt in our diet has been replaced with rock salt and sea salt over the last thirty years. This loss of iodine consumption contributed to an emergence of the disease not seen since 1930.

With six epidemiologists working from their homes around Australia, it wasn’t until 2014 that the business decided to add a fulltime employee. That’s when Ausvet joined fSpace to have, as Ben puts it, “A workspace that wasn’t just my kitchen table.” Growth took off and it was little more than a year later that Ben decided he needed to employ more people in WA and would need a larger space of their own. “We now have 10 people in Western Australia and 30 people globally, with key offices here and in Canberra, and a growing presence in France.” His team mostly travels to their clients to conduct investigations and collect data, but they occasionally stay longer (up to 7 months!) to implement solutions.

(Ausvet project in Namibia)

Although growth continues to be a goal, Ben doesn’t want Ausvet to become a massive corporation. “We’d like to have a staff of maybe 60 to 70 across three or four offices, so we’re about halfway there.” Ben wants enough in-house people with different backgrounds to develop a unique solution to each problem, while still contracting relevant specialists.

Through diagnostic work and subsequent trials, Ausvet is often involved in making significant changes to processes and policies in both business and industry. Focusing on research and solutions that can make a difference, Ausvet’s final reports include practical policy options so that changes can actually be implemented.

They strive not only to solve problems but to inspire the owners of the problems to manage them, regardless of whether the problems are found on a farm, in an industry, even a country. This affirms the value that Ausvet places on sustainability and why they always keep the big picture at the forefront. They are particularly pleased that after working in Indonesia to develop a national animal and public health system, it is now fully managed by Indonesia, receiving thousands of individual messages a day from across the archipelago.

“Change is useless if we cannot empower people to manage it themselves.”

Ben’s team can collect an incredibly high volume of data during their research. Dealing with upward of three million samples a day, they translate the data into workable information so that the right decisions can be made. “We used to think our clients wanted more data, but actually they want us to translate ‘data’ into ‘information’ so they can make evidence based decisions.”

Ausvet reinforces their community ideology by creating solutions that actually work in practice, not just in theory. Making a difference to the health of a community is not just an aspiration; it is a prerequisite of their work.

“We don’t want to be just another cog in the wheel.”

Our planet is one huge eco-system. The impact of humans on this ecosystem is undeniable, and we expect to see new diseases emerging continuously. Ben, although optimistic, realises that Ausvet can’t change everything. “We are not trying to solve all the world’s problems, but we feel very strongly that we can have an impact in some way.” Ben’s team is actively trying to change perceptions of those in power that there will be a single silver bullet solution, and those who treat the symptom instead of dealing with the often-complex causes of the problem.

(Ausvet project in Cambodia)

Ben believes a workspace can have major impacts on lifestyle and happiness, as well as on the focus and determination of a staff. Ben also believes that just walking around your area can remind you of what is important in life, adding “If you just drive your car into a basement of the office you work in, you’re not engaging with your community very much.” This engagement with community and sense of purpose are cornerstones of his business philosophy.

Ben’s time at fSpace influenced him to engage with others, which in turn became an important aspect of his business. When Ausvet moved into its own space, Ben focused on creating an environment that would inspire his team more than a paycheque. By treating them as members of a community rather than reinforcing a hierarchy, Ausvet is more focused on solving problems than running a traditional business.

According to Ben, basing their operations in Fremantle is “probably a mix of pure practicality and slight idealism.” Ausvet wanted to avoid the congestion of the Perth CBD while remaining connected to public transport to limit their use of personal vehicles. Heavily involved within the agriculture and aquaculture industries, they are close to Murdoch University and the hospitals with which they work. Fremantle’s port city artistic heritage also provides a beautiful scenic place to walk around with ample options for lunch and coffee; all of which contribute to the revitalisation of spirit and focus.

Ben’s vision for the future includes a public understanding that health problems are multifactorial and there is rarely just one cause. The reality of the agriculture industry is that many of the health problems Ausvet solves are economically caused. For instance, giving more space to animals such as chickens and pigs would help to reduce some problems, however the costs of such changes are often more than consumers are prepared to pay. Ben believes in a healthy equilibrium: “Consumers need to realise that environmental balance has a cost. If they want it, they have to be willing to pay more.”

“Will it work out in the future?”

My final question hung in the air between us and Ben thought about it for a moment. “Humans are where we are today because we managed to solve all the problems that have been put in front of us so far. I have enormous faith that humans can solve these problems. My only real concern is that people seem to be increasingly focused on ‘What is in it for me?’ and not in ‘What is in it for the broader society?’”

With a vision of ‘one world, one health’, Ben and Ausvet will continue to do what they can to solve health problems and encourage decisions that lead to a healthier and more sustainable planet.

The following is from FREMANTLE Space, the fSpace magazine which celebrates the people who have embraced the ethos of small coworking space in the heart of Fremantle.

Smart Living

Words: Sabine Albers, Artwork: TRAM

Living Smart is a behavioural change program that helps people take action in their own homes to improve their quality of life and reduce their environmental impact.

Sabine: How would you introduce yourself?

Dr Stephanie Jennings: I’m Steph and I’m someone who’s decided to live life at a slower pace, a more sustainable pace. A pace that gives me more time to do the things I love, like spending time with my young children, commuting in environmental friendly ways, and enjoying the vibrant community I live in – Fremantle.

I’m a scientist with a focus in energy efficiency and building design and am privileged to be part of Living Smart, a Fremantle not-for-profit that has won national awards and has increased its reach beyond WA.

Living Smart is a behaviour change program that helps people take action to improve their quality of life and reduce their environmental impact.

It’s about connecting people too. It’s about building community, which is hard in this day and age. fSpace is part of that too so that’s a nice cross over.

People who take our courses also meet others who are looking to take action, which creates new friendships.

What makes Living Smart so unique?

There are so many programs out there that people just dip in and dip out, and it barely causes a ripple in their lives. What I love about ours is it really works.

Part of it is we use behavioural psychology to effectively build capacity within individuals to make change. It’s not just about technology – it’s exploring how you live, how you want to live, and what makes you happy.

Within the course there are some traditional education elements, but a lot of time is spent discussing solutions. It’s very interactive, but there’s also time for reflection.

It’s really about moving off the problem and looking at what can we do. There’s no shaming. It’s all about positive actions we can take and every action, large or small, is celebrated.

Living Smart focuses on ten topics that can make a change. What are some key points people can work on?

It gets people to start on whatever point is relevant them. It might be waste, it might be what’s happening in their garden, it might be their own health or improving their home.

You get exposed to the full content of the course and you might be surprised by what you don’t know. With that content, the goal setting and reflection time, you can find a topic that really fires you up, that you can put your energy into.

We share ideas like practical ways to remember to take a bag to the supermarket so you don’t use plastic bags. We also talk about the global waste issue and how together we are making a difference. You don’t feel alone with it.

So the focus is on helping people find a place to start and reminding them that small changes do make a difference.

That’s exactly what it’s about. It’s working out where you want to start or progress to, then taking some fresh actions and seeing that you are not alone. The conversations are very positive.

Due to its broad nature, people typically start with one topic and then it flows onto another. Someone might start by just turning off the tap while they’re brushing their teeth. And then they might start to think about their choice of toothbrush, whether it’s compostable or disposable. And then they might start to look at cleaning products in the bathroom. There’s a lot of flow on things called spillover in terms of behaviours.

Change can be difficult. What can help start to make a change within a community?

Our lives are so busy with so many distractions that a key step is just slowing down and making time to ask the important questions that are often ignored. Questions like are you actually heading where you want to go? What are the things you cherish? Are you giving those things enough time? Are you living the way you want or just dealing with the guilt of not living the way you want?

That’s an example of what people go through on this journey. They may realise that they need to downshift, to simplify their lives, to create some space.

So is looking after the planet also looking after your own health?

It is. Part of the impact on the planet comes from people trying to do a lot and the resource consumption goes with that – doing a lot, driving a lot, consuming a lot. Slower lives have smaller footprints.

I just do what I can to inspire people to tread gently on our planet.

The following is from FREMANTLE Space, the fSpace magazine which celebrates the people who have embraced the ethos of small coworking space in the heart of Fremantle.

A Crazy Dutchy

Words: Sabine Albers, Photography: Anna Duwe 

At its best, community is an experience of deep connection and awareness. It allows us to be ourselves and focus on things that are valuable. When we are in the right space, feeling safe, respected and supported, we are more confident. We flourish.

Our world is beautiful, but it carries a lot of weight and can feel disconnected at the best of times. I love creating beauty, to add it to our world, to help reconnect it. I take great joy from connecting people and seeing them thrive together. The energy from that is beautiful and powerful.

It’s hard to believe that our Fremantle space is five years old. I started fSpace with pure joy and crazy enthusiasm. I wanted to meet people and connect on a creative level – to share, collaborate and inspire. So many things have changed over the years and there are many things to celebrate, but what I love each time I walk into fSpace is the experience of being part of a community – of bringing people together around ideas that we believe will bring joy and growth on a personal and global level.

A community also creates opportunity – not just to collaborate or land a new client or project. A community can connect you to others and raise your level of inspiration. Conversations can help you evolve and expand your vision, and great things can happen from there.

A community can be a space where you really meet and connect with others. A space where you share thoughts and ideas, from helping improve the lives of others, fighting legal battles for the disadvantaged, or creating stunning designs. A space where you’re part of a more empathetic society.

Communities like this aren’t specific to a religion, culture or identity. They are inclusive around passion, ideas and interest. fSpace doesn’t fit in a box.

We are young and old and in-between. We are men and women. We are locals and we are from all over the world.

For me, success is to go into the world and create something that is part of the lifestyle you want to live. Our common goal is we want to make a positive change in the world and we seek inspiration to do so.

I’m delighted, excited and honoured to celebrate five years of this. Sincere thanks to everyone who’s been a part of our small space in Fremantle, and for sharing their awesome, extraordinary selves.

Images by Miles Noel

A big thanks to Dave Coggin, Deputy Mayor of Fremantle, for his visit to fSpace last week.

The Deputy Mayor was on hand to mark the launch of the second round of the Business Development Program, a joint initiative between fSpace and The City of Fremantle to support small businesses.

As with the initial launch, this program helps subsidize workspace for qualified applicants who work within the creative industries.

The Deputy Mayor met with Sabine to discuss the program, including a review of the results from the initial program. He then chatted with a variety of people working from fSpace, including several participants from the initial program.

Applications for the program are now available. Visit https://fspace.me/business/ for more information.

Thanks again to the Deputy Mayor and The City of Fremantle for their support with this program.

Hello there,

Exciting news! fSpace is a finalist for a Business of the Year Award with the Fremantle Chamber of Commerce for ‘Excellence in Professional Services’. Too bad it isn’t ‘Excellence in Best Cool Group of Fun Entrepreneurs’ because we would win every year! 😉

The Fremantle Business awards is an initiative of the Fremantle Chamber of Commerce. Over 400 business owners and employees are expected to be on hand at the awards gala evening on June 10. This event is not just to announce the winners, but to celebrate exceptional business achievements within Fremantle over the past year.

Check out all awesome Fremantle finalists right here: http://www.fremantlebusinessawards.com.au/finalists.html

We had some great responds and media exposure about our new partnership with the City of Fremantle. In the last 6 months some great new businesses have joined fSpace. Great collaboration is happening and the energy and buzz is awesome.

The news has gone across several media channels and has helped getting fSpace out there. Keep spreading the word and come see us to experience some of the buzz yourself.

See you soon!
Sabine

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